Lukashenka to Euroradio: If you want me to retire, I will!

Zmitser Lukashuk: Hello! Zmitser Lukashuk, European Radio for Belarus. Alyaksandr Rygoravich, you have expressed some dissatisfaction with the fact that we have an open dialogue here today, yet but it is constantly being turned into a press conference without discussions, and nobody expresses an opinion. That's why I think I should first express my opinion on the subject, which is being very much discussed today.

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: Please, go ahead!

Zmitser Lukashuk: You spoke a lot about the brotherly people of Russia, about the fact that we have a very warm relationship ... Who would have thought a year ago that between the brotherly peoples of Russia and Ukraine there will be such a conflict that we are obserbving today. If someone says that Russia has nothing to do with it, then I think our Belarusian security services, intelligence report to you about who actually supplies equipment there, etc. Why am I talking about it? You said you are convinced that such a scenario will not happen again. But I'm not 100% sure! In some Russian media outlets - and I will not name them not to promote them, Belarusians are referred to as vyshyvantsy (those wearing traditional clothing with elements of ethnic embroidery). When I read those outlets, I have a feeling that Lukashenka of Belarus will soon be turned into Bandera, all Russian schools will be closed and we will soon begin to eat Russian bullfinches. I have a feeling that they want to acieve a political retirement, possibly with the help of some Russian or pro-Russian candidate in the next presidential election.

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: Whose retirement?

Zmitser Lukashuk: Retirement for t the head of state in Belarus, however surprising it may seem...

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: My retirement?! Ohh!

Zmitser Lukashuk: Funny people! I agree with you! (both laughing)

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: Thank you, Dzmitry!

Zmitser Lukashuk: The question is: how much are you still on the lookout for such a Russian candidate? And if we are discussing this issue, you have said many times that you would run as many times as the Belarusian people ask you to. The support is there, of course, no question about it. But if the Belarusian people ask you to do it in 2025 and in 2050, will you? Is there some limit that you set for yourself like: people asked me to run, but I will say it is enough?

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: I guarantee, Dzmitry,  people will not ask me of this in 2050.

Zmitser Lukashuk: And why not?!

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: I guarantee you that they will not. Do not worry about it. Thank you for this question. But let's try to be cleare again and close this topic at least before the presidential election in 2015. Why?! I'll explain. I'll start with the election and my own perception of the presidential election process in general, and then I'll move to the Russian speculations that you mentioned. If I forget something, remind me, please.

As for my retirement, I was very clear on this in the Kremlin. It is impossible to make me cave in! It was clear, who it was aimed at. And it is understood by those to whom it was addressed. No Kremlin, no Moscow, no West can make me cave in. This will not happen! You can hang me up, you can kill me, you can drown me somewhere... but it is impossible to make me dance to someone else's tune, change my policy! I do not think you would disagree with me, because I have already demonstrated it in over 20 years. It's not because I'm stubborn and do not take criticism, some comments, etc. I do perceive them and I am very sorry if I'm wrong. So do not try to make me cave in!

As for retirement, if you, the Russian people sent me to retirement in the presidential election, then ... of course it would be unpleasant for me, as for anyone, to lose the campaign. I would not like it, but I would not take it like I did 10-15 years ago. Maybe I would have been hurt for a week, but I have already convinced myself that if people decided so, it is their decision. But if something goes wrong with the country, sorry! You have chosen this path, you've decided to chose this person. I have nothing to do with it. I am thinking like a man now. Maybe I should not say this, but I feel this way.

Secondly, you know, I will learn nothing new in the presidency in this presidential life. Over 20 years, I have understood everything; I already felt everything. I cannot say that I'm not interested - presidential work every day is something new and interesting, but not as much as it was before. Therefore, as a man, I do not think that today, as President, I develop the same way as 10 years ago, when I was like a sponge and I had to practically absorb everything and act. Today, I feel a little bit easier in this regard.

I often hear from the opposition media,"20 years, isn't that enough?" I, too, as a person, think: listen, isn't it enough really?! But I will not and cannot get out of it. I have no right. I have already explained that if the country collapses after I have left, I would be accused of cowardice and they will hold me responsible. And they will be right! if I am still alive at the time. And I am honestly telling you that this is so. So do not think that I am too tense in this regard. Yes, I am a politician, I have to fight, as it is accepted by the laws of politics. I have some luggage, I am hard to find guilty of something, like they do with others... Even you would feel uneasy about criticizing me, you can see clearly how other presidents live.

If you criticize me for this residence, may Lord be with you! Take a look at any part of it, you will see the work of Belarusian specialists. It was a national project. All our creative people were out of work (painters, decorators, etc.), go, do, create, show me the picture and act. If you pass through these halls, and we nedded this building ... At some point in time I will tell you why I did it, why it was done to a certain date, etc. And I told you at the beginning, Dzmitri, with intent. You probably did not notice that it is our national stronghold, it is our heart. It should be this way: our flag, our flag Square and the Palace of Independence. And the first people to come here were the heads of state. Arriving here, they de facto recognized the independence of our country. Congratulating me on this creation of the Belarusian people, they said that it is impressive. Yes, it cost certain funds. And you wanted to do something great and for free? Belarusians sometimes do, but it is unlikely that it will turn out fine, it's not my way. So if you tell me to retire, I will, nothing else to do about it!

Zmitser Lukashuk: Maybe you will want to step down at your own consent?

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: Oh! If I want to? My position is such that if I want something, my wishes do not account for anything. I am the president of the country, and I do less of what I want, but more of what you want. And on the main issues and trends, I do the way you want. Want an example? I'll give you one! Raising the retirement age. There are certain criteria, I have told you about this in person. Do you think we should, Dzmitry, raise the retirement age?

Zmitser Lukashuk: It is still too early for me to think about it, but people say they would not want it.

Alyaksandr Lukashenka: Oh! Should it be done? There is a norm according to the law: one pensioner for not less than two employed people. And we have one and a half working persons for a pensioner. So is it necessary or not? It is! I told this to the people, but you are right, people do not want it. So why should I contradict them?! And I took this issue off the agenda. It's not there now. But these one and a half men sustain a pensioner. And here is how much they can earn - 25 trillion rubles - pensioners are welcome to share it with each other, since you do not want to raise the retirement age. If there are more retirees and fewer workers, then the pension will be lower. Where can I get more money for pensioners? Take away from others! Can I do this? No.

So I openly say how this is possible, but you do not want it! But not how I should do it as an economist who has received calculations from experts. That's why I'm doing a lot less than I want. I do it the way you want it, also because I promise you this in the elections. And I stick to my promises. In the vast majority of cases. Therefore I have no right to withdraw myself from the election, I also have talked about this. If I do not have the reason to do it. The sole basis for the president not to go to the polls is dementia, stupidity, or disease. Then you should not go. And if you are weak-minded and do not know that, your children, relatives and friends, your immediate political environment must warn you and keep from taking these steps. And if you're a normal healthy person, then go. But people must decide your fate. It is my understanding. It does not have to be the same, as you say, the opinion of the editorial staff. Therefore, if I am alive and well in 2015, you may see me on the list of candidates for president. If you vote against me, I'll take it as I should.

Next. As you said, one hundred percent that Russia would not do this to us as they did in Ukraine, etc. You know, I have hardly anything more to add. I believe that Russia today is not up to it. Russia had enough of it with Ukraine. What are they blaming it for, Russia? Well, probably, for the most part it did not deserve it. It was the way it was. Is Russia to blame for this? Well, I guess, it is partly. You know my position on Crimea. I voiced it frankly both to the current president and the former one etc. You set yourself up. You think it's your land? You had to fight for it. Since you didn't, it is not yours. And there is nothing to suffer and weep about now. I'm just repeating myself. The whole world knows about it.

Regarding all kinds of scribes in Russia, you probably know about the articles written by people from the Russian Institute for Strategic Studies. You have surely probably read all those scribbles.

Zmicier Lukashuk: I did the interview with that expert, Alexander Sytsin.

Alexander Lukashenka: No, no. I mean: have you read what this Sytsin and others wrote?

Zmicier Lukashuk: Yes.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Well, I did not read that interview with him. I will ask to give me to read it.

Zmicier Lukashuk: By the way, his forecasts about the future relations between Belarus and Russia are unpleasant for us.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Well, this is his point of view. Anyway, when he writes that some figures bring some memos to the president via the office of the president, this totally makes sense. This is not something new to me. Once I was making a speech in the parliament and I criticized this structure (Russian Institute for Strategic Studies). I think it used to be part of Russian foreign intelligence service. Later, it was transferred under the auspieces of the Office of the [Russian] President, and then those scribes scribbled something for money. This is outrageous! Anyway, I am aware of what they wrote. Moreover, I told about it to President (Putin) during a private conversation. So, he told me: “Alexander Ryhoravich, so many people write to me. Don’t think that I am reading all of it.” I have quoted him here as saying. Well, I don’t treat this statement simplistically, but I can see it. I can hear it. Excuse me, but when there are such idiots there who bring such materials to the office of the president or to the president, they just want to make money on that by flattering. So, perhaps, you are right to think that one cannot be 100 percent confident that everything is fine around us. You are definitely right. Therefore, take it easy. And I will also read the interview that you did.

Zmicier Lukashuk: I also wanted to follow the footstep of my friend Valer Kalinouski. Euroradio could not have an interview with you back in 1994 when you were running as a presidential candidate, because Euroradio did not exist back then yet. But I worked at that time at the radio station Belaruskaya Maladzyozhnaya, which you visited. So, taking this opportunity as a former staffer at Belaruskaya Maladzyozhnaya radio station, I ask you to give me an interview for Euroradio.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Did you see that? Now I have to pay back for something what happened 20 years ago. Well, life is life. I will have to pay back. But probably you will have questions similar to those from Radio Svaboda, so probably it is better together?

Zmicier Lukashuk: I think Kalinouski will not object.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: No-no-no. It is up to you. If I owe you, I will have to pay back. This is not so expensive to me. And of courseу, your listeners should hear from me some answers to some questions. So, I do not rule it (interview) out.  Make arrangements with the press secretary without too much delay or just pick a good moment in the schedule when I can give an interview. I do not consider you as enemy, yet I do not always agree with the stance that Euroradio transmits to the whole world. But this is youre right. I cannot ban you from doing that or close down your radio.

Zmicier Lukashuk: At least, this is some good news. Thank you!

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Did you think I was going to close Euroradio down?

Zmicier Lukashuk: I did not think you were going to, yet I think you have such a possibility.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Why? Shutting Euroradio down will increase its influence. Ryhor Kisel (ONT TV channel CEO) taught me once during the first presidential campaign: "You pay no attention to them. It will be better. When you close them down, everybody will immediately be interested.” Later, I realized myself that not everything is worth attention and I should not fight everyone, especially simultaneously. After all, why do I need to fight you? There is no need now. You are not yet as dangerous as to prompt me to pull a rifle and shoot. Unarmed combat is enough for now (laughing).

Zmicier Lukashuk: We do not want to fight either. Perhaps, you could give us an FM frequency...

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Do you see that? (laughs) I stated from the very beginning that certain requirements should be developed. Frequencies are a state resource, and it is very important. If you meet those requirements, I do not rule out that you can win a competition for some FM frequency. Is it right? Oh, Dzmitry, I am told there are no free frequencies available!

Lilia Ananich (minister of information): Competition is huge, indeed. There are many of those willing, but there are no free frequencies. This is not something handed out by Ananich. It is in the competence of the National Commission on Frequencies. It is a serious matter. Unfortunately, as of today, we do not have additional frequencies to offer.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Look, maybe we can take from Kisel and give it to them?

Zmicier Lukashuk: I agree!

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Oh! Democracy! Take and divide! But this is not something promoted by this radio?!

Zmicier Lukashuk: Well, democrats take use of opportunities.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: (laughs) But if there is a frequency, (Euroradio) can take part, right?

Lilia Ananich: Any registered news media can apply according to a relevant procedure. Currently, applications are rejected – not only for Euroradio. For example, Homelskaya Prauda newspaper registered their media resource Prauda Radio. But we together with the Ministry of Communication have problems to provide the signal for the whole territory of Homel region, unfortunately. I think it could be an interesting radio, in demand in the region, but unfortunately the existing frequencies there overlap with some frequencies in the Russian Federation thus creating a conflict. But I think Euroradio’s voice is now available on the internet. Nowadays, one cannot say that there are no technical possibilities to disseminate information, because internet covers the whole world.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: In your opinion, Euroradio is normal or hostile?

Lilia Ananich: If the information minister chooses to be hostile to media, this is surely not right. If they operate within the legal framework,…
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Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Wait, wait, Lilia. You are a state official; it is not about you personally. I am talking about the state. Is [Euroradio] hostile to the state?

Lilia Ananich: It has had no warnings yet under the law. But we are closely watching and analyzing its content. I think Euroradio has all legal grounds to work in the Republic of Belarus, while the Ministry of Information will thoroughly analyze the content of Euroradio and any other media outlet.

Aliaksandr Lukashenka: Ok then.